Episode 8 - Rob Sonic
Welcome to the loadout. I'm your host, Ashanti Abdulla. In each week, we take you behind the scenes of the live music industry From touring tips and industry insights to candid conversations with artists, managers, and music professionals, we uncover the stories and strategies that make live performances unforgettable. Whether you're an artist, a tour manager, or just a live music enthusiast, this podcast is your backstage pass to the world of touring and live events. On today's version of the loadout, I'm joined by none other than hip hop legend, Rob Sonic.
Ashanti:From his groundbreaking solo work to his collaborations with Aesop Rock and Harold Larry Malon, Rob has been a force in the underground hip hop scene for years. We're diving into his journey, his thoughts on touring, and what keeps him inspired after all this time. Rob Sonic, Bananas Foster, Bobby Freedom. Don't they call you the purveyor of premium small batch hip hop?
Rob Sonic:Some people do. Only me, though. Though. I call them something.
Ashanti:How you been, bro? It's been a minute.
Rob Sonic:It has been a minute, man. I've been alright. You know? Dealing. Dealing.
Rob Sonic:You know? I'm I'm getting up there in here, so, you know, I'm I'm, I'm good for the most part. You know, can't complain. I'm here. I'm breathing.
Rob Sonic:So I'm I'm breathing.
Ashanti:That's right. That's right. You're back on the west or you're out on the west coast now from the east coast a little bit. Kinda in between, you were saying?
Rob Sonic:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Split time between, you know, the East Coast, New York, and DC. I'm from DC originally.
Ashanti:Oh, gotcha.
Rob Sonic:So, but, you know, lived most of my life in the Bronx. But, yeah.
Ashanti:Ace is still up Ace is still up there. Right?
Rob Sonic:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He's on the he's on we're in the same city, so we're we're going
Ashanti:to call up.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. Yeah.
Ashanti:That's what's up, man. That's what's up. My bad. We, we we we had a little bit of talking before we got recording, so let's just get into the real business of it. What like, you you started rapping at age 12.
Ashanti:Is that correct?
Rob Sonic:Yeah. About 11 or 12. Yeah.
Ashanti:11 or 12. What were those influences? Well, like, what got this kid from from DC that moved to New York? I assume it was the move to New York. I mean, I don't know.
Rob Sonic:No. I was still in DC at that time. When I when I first started writing rhymes, I was still in DC, and it was just basically that everybody and, you know, everybody in my school was doing it, and it was just, like, breaking and and rhyming and just hip hop in general. The culture was, was coming up. And it wasn't, it was, it was just, you know, everybody was, everybody who I affiliated with and everybody I associated with was doing it.
Rob Sonic:And, you know, it was it was it was new and it was something that that we just wanted to do. And in all the all the ways, you know what I'm saying? Like all the elements and and all the all the the the the ways to express ourselves was it was just hip hop, and it was just that's where it was coming from. I guess the early stuff was probably, obviously, Sugar Hill stuff and and but it was a it was a little bit little bit deeper than that. Like, it was because it wasn't really available like that back then.
Rob Sonic:It was like hours on the radio here and there, but it it wasn't when it first started and and people were first starting to embrace rap, it wasn't out there like it is now. It's a big, huge, you know, biggest music in the world now, probably. Outside of Definitely. Outside of maybe country, but it wasn't like that. It was a real counterculture when it started when it came, when it when it came out.
Rob Sonic:And and there's a reason for that is, you know, obviously, you know, the people that, you know, the the just the people making it and the the environment it comes from, you know, is Yeah. That's just what it is. It's just people doing that and that was the, you know, my associates were and friends were all people that did it and they were like, yo, just, you know, just be down, Just just be doing what all my friends did. You know?
Ashanti:Exactly. Wait. So you picked you picked rhyming because you're a shit breakdancer or what? How did that end up?
Rob Sonic:Yeah. But well, I went through all of them. I went through all of them.
Ashanti:Yeah. I think we all did. That's why I ended up being a DJ because I was like, I can't fucking rap. This I suck. Like, what?
Rob Sonic:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But that that was basically it. The gist of it was that basically I I saw I started off, I guess, breaking.
Rob Sonic:And that was just because, like, you know, that's that was just so big at the time. It it just swept across the you know, it was, like, why, 82, 83 when breaking was, like, popping. And I was, like, 10 years old. So it was like, you know, I'd try to do it, but I wasn't really you know, I was kind of a fat kid, so I couldn't really I I I had some moves, though. You know what I'm saying?
Rob Sonic:I had I had some things, but when you got into, like you know, they they were dudes who were, like, really, really good at it. You know, like to and to be good at break dance, it's an Olympic sport now.
Ashanti:Yeah, for sure.
Rob Sonic:You know what I'm saying? Like break dance is just hard, man. Yeah. Like that shit is straight up gymnastics. You know what I'm saying?
Rob Sonic:Like like I saw dudes, you know, when I was, like, that age, and I have to I'll do my little thing at home in the mirror, you know, try to get my little shuffle, my little 6 step, or or a little with you know, knee spin or whatever backspin going. And then you see dudes who are really good at breakdancing, and you're like, oh, I can't do that.
Ashanti:Yeah. Not even close, bro.
Rob Sonic:That dude is doing, like, aerials and shit. They're doing, like, they're doing, like, shit you do on a pommel horse on a floor.
Ashanti:I mean, pop master Fable doesn't even do all of that. He's a pop master, and he's still way more than I could ever even dream of.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you know, I I I had a little little wave and everything here and there, and, but I just wasn't you know, it it was really you know, when I was in a couple of crews, you know, the local crews and battle some dudes, and we did the battle thing, you know, the the breakdance battle stuff. And I realized then that I was like, after, like, couple of battles, and I was just like, nah.
Rob Sonic:I'm not really holding anybody down. So so so dudes were like, okay. So maybe try DJing, you know, like, hold the box. You know? Right.
Rob Sonic:Because they you know, they you still gotta be there in case, like, somebody gets injured because
Ashanti:you can get injured.
Rob Sonic:You can get injured and break these battles.
Ashanti:You know what
Rob Sonic:I'm saying? Like, you can the the shit that people are doing is that you can break an ankle or some shit, you know, or nap. For sure. You know? I mean, I I had a suicide at one point, which is like a flip, you know, where you just basically land on the small of your back and feet first.
Rob Sonic:So it doesn't it's sort of like a wrestling kind of thing, like a wrestling flip. You know? And, like, I just think about it sometimes. I'm like, I coulda broke every I coulda broke my spine just doing that.
Ashanti:You know? Like, I don't even know how I quit, I quit skateboarding about 3 years ago because I broke my last bone. Yeah. And I'm, like, in my forties, and I was like, nah. Yeah.
Ashanti:Let's say for
Rob Sonic:me no more. No more. No. I mean, yeah, you gotta go all out in both of those things. You just go all out, and kids just have that energy.
Rob Sonic:You know? So I had
Ashanti:to Sorry. No. Go ahead.
Rob Sonic:So I was good in that respect. Like, I I was I was always, you know, I loved it so much and, was into it so much that I was ready to do ready to break break whatever if I had to.
Ashanti:I had a similar similar story. I, I wanted to do everything. I wanted to do graffiti. Well, I'm a shit artist. I can't pave a straight line.
Ashanti:Yeah. I'm definitely not I'm a dancer, but not that kind of dancer.
Rob Sonic:Right.
Ashanti:And I couldn't rap to save my life. Yep. And so I became a DJ. And then every I mean, people who know me, they know that, like, over time, I was good enough. And then over time, everyone else got better than me.
Ashanti:And I was like, cool. Well, I guess I'll just book the shows and do all this other stuff because that's what I'm good at. So that's how I ended up in that side of it. You know?
Rob Sonic:Right. Right. So it's it's not it's not unsimilar to that. You know what I'm saying? Like, that is ex that is essentially what happened.
Rob Sonic:It just it just, I guess, so, you know, they were like, I'll just hold the box or whatever while we do while we do our battles or whatever. And then I tried to DJ for a little while and I just couldn't scratch. Right? Because but, yeah, I've always had, like, this disconnect and it's always caused me problems throughout my my musical career is like because I produce and I I can make beats and stuff, but my left hand is just
Ashanti:I I can't get
Rob Sonic:it to do what I want. So if you're a DJ, you you gotta have both that ambidextrous thing going on where you can work the fader and and scratch. So I think I got a bubble scratch back when, like, DST was like, you know, the, you know, obviously coming out and killing shit. But I was like, I got, like, a bubble scratch once, and that was that was the extent of my DJ career. But but back but back then, it wasn't like people had, like, direct drive turntables even.
Ashanti:Nah. Like, you had, like, belt driven. Yep.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. Like,
Ashanti:Belt driven. For making it work.
Rob Sonic:Dude, you had to forget it.
Ashanti:Yeah. That's right. Making it work. Yeah. Not just for Except for, you know, that that makes me think of, Eric being Rakim.
Ashanti:I ain't no joke. Mhmm. That's gotta be the worst display of scratching of all time. And then I was talking to somebody and they were like, yo, Eric B was the drug dealer, B. He wasn't really in the band.
Ashanti:You know what I mean? Rakim was just giving him a shot. You know what I'm saying? Like
Rob Sonic:I mean, I I lived in Queens for a while. I'm not I don't know about the the history
Ashanti:of that.
Rob Sonic:That is, you know? But I don't I don't I don't really talk about things like that, but, you know, I'm saying, like, you know, it's it's it's he Eric b was, you know, he was he was in there.
Ashanti:He was the man, bro.
Rob Sonic:He was
Ashanti:the man. Yeah. Early early like Eventually, I mean, just
Rob Sonic:to just to wrap it up. Yeah. I just I I was tried brass and I I had no can control. And then I started rapping and and I could actually hold the beat better than a lot of people. So
Ashanti:Right. That's dope, man. Were there any, like, particular moments or experiences that, like, like, significantly shaped what your sound was gonna be kinda early on? Or I'm sure you've probably progressed over the years. It's been different things.
Ashanti:But
Rob Sonic:Yes. Craft work, I remember. Craft work, soul Sonic Force, specifically, planet rock, play at your own risk. I've I always forget who would I forget who that is, but and that sucks because that's like one of my I still play that shit to this day. Mhmm.
Rob Sonic:And, a lot of electro shit. And Mantronix was was huge for me in the beginning. Just in in the early sound of Def Jam. When, you know, when Def Jam came out, what was it like? Tila Wright.
Rob Sonic:Right? It was the first Yeah. Def Jam. I think so. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:So, Yeah. Yeah. That that, like, hard sort of it it wasn't the most rhythmic thing. You know what I'm saying? Mhmm.
Rob Sonic:And and that kinda that kinda had, like, real that shit that had, like, that edge that was kinda busted and kinda like it felt very, like, rebellious and and and pumped. So Mhmm. That that was always what really spoke to me the most. Gotcha. That one I wasn't the happiest kid coming up.
Ashanti:I feel you. I mean, I think that I mean yeah. I mean, that will definitely draw you to hip hop at the earlier days. Obviously, there was a bright, shiny reason for kids to for kids to add to it later on. But in the early days, yeah.
Ashanti:I mean, hip hop was punk. Punk was hip hop. It was it was Yeah, man. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:It was it was all it was all just like, yeah, with, you know, the the voice of the voiceless. Right?
Ashanti:For sure.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. Like like, heads didn't really know, you know, we were just the youth of of the the eighties and shit. We're just like, what what are we supposed to do? Yeah.
Ashanti:What are we supposed to do?
Rob Sonic:Man and obviously crack and all that shit. Like Yeah. The fuckers are just like, yo, what are what are we supposed to do?
Ashanti:I mean, as much as it annoys the shit out of me, I can't even be mad at, like, the, like, the the the teams and the people of this time and, like, what they're up to. No.
Rob Sonic:You know
Ashanti:what I mean? Because, like, there was always something. And, like, to be honest with you, some of the shit they're up to is, like, smarter. You know? And you're like, that's a smarter way to do that, actually.
Rob Sonic:Well, yeah, man. They they have so much more access to information than we do. True. You know what I'm saying? We were we were, like, you know, like, or whatever.
Rob Sonic:What do you call it? Urban legends and shit. Yeah. Right? Like, that kind of thing.
Rob Sonic:Like
Ashanti:I heard this. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. Yeah. Like, don't put pop rocks in Coke.
Ashanti:Right. Don't put You
Rob Sonic:know what I'm saying? Now they just that's a that's like a challenge
Ashanti:now. Right.
Rob Sonic:Right. You know, they they I you know, there's there's obvious things that I'm like, that that's real dangerous for the for the culture. You know? Sure. But but how much of that is necessarily just what we've left them?
Rob Sonic:So
Ashanti:Yeah. No. That's that's what it that's what it comes down to, really. It's like Yeah.
Rob Sonic:So you can't you can't really be like, nah. You know? Like, unless you, like, really did it. Like like, okay. This is, you know, I'm I I am the person that stood on business on on the for the community
Ashanti:Mhmm.
Rob Sonic:For the kids and and but I wasn't thinking about that shit. And I'm sure a lot of our rappers wouldn't think about that shit when they get got on. No. You know? We're just rappers.
Ashanti:Yeah. You, how'd your experiences with, Sonic some and Hail Mary Malin shape your solo career?
Rob Sonic:I learned a lot with Sonic some.
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:With Sonic some, it was the the the Sonic some stuff was was interesting because I was coming at it from I had met Mike Ladd, and Mike Ladd sort of, you know, he he's sort of the dude. You know? And and and then I the poetry scene. And, I just wasn't at that point of years years years of trying to get on, I was like, man, I gotta do something different to sorta separate myself from me and my man. Like, the sonic sum was originally me and my rap partner.
Rob Sonic:The Sonic sum that everybody knows it, that's not how it started. It started with me and this my man, Seams, rest in peace, from Corona Queens. And I was living in in East Elmhurst at the time, I think. Mhmm. And, we were just trying to do something a little different.
Rob Sonic:You know? And and and it was it was still it was still, like, you know, it was still bars and everything, but but we we were trying to branch out a little bit and do just super creative stuff because we were both in the real heavy into jazz music. Mhmm. And, the the the sort of the process of being a jazz head is you had you go further into the backstory of because it's not it it's like the stars of jazz music. It's not like the stars of other shit.
Ashanti:Right. You know what
Rob Sonic:I'm saying? Like, these these are like these are like musicians, like like Mingus and and and, so many others, like, you know, Charlie Parker and, like, the backstory of those dudes, it's not it's not like this glamorous thing. It was
Ashanti:just
Rob Sonic:No. Not at all. Dudes who are just they're just ill characters. You know what I'm saying? Like like, ill by nature.
Rob Sonic:Yep. So so that's we sorta wanted to go. We you don't wanna be that because that's like, these are greats. You know? Mhmm.
Rob Sonic:Mhmm. It's like somebody wanting to be like, yes. Everybody would aspire to be Jimmy Hendrix or or Jimmy Page, but you're not gonna you know?
Ashanti:You don't wanna be you don't wanna live that life. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:So we kinda wanted to be to to be as as, like, principally sound to a creative movement in music in that happened to be rap because that's what we did.
Ashanti:Mhmm.
Rob Sonic:Right? And then he passed away and and we had this sort of body of work with TME and then that was Fred and John and Eric was around. So we just sort of became Sonic some later. We kept that going Mhmm. You know, after after seems passed.
Rob Sonic:But, so I learned a lot about that. I learned a lot about, like, yes, you can aspire to be this this great, like, person that changes whatever it is, you know? And, but it's you also have to be sort of accepting of the fact that that that stuff is there's some other worldly stuff with, like, Miles Davis. Like, it's like there there's something else going on. You know?
Rob Sonic:And you have to you have to understand, like, you know, that you have to be receptive to that kind of energy. Those vibrations coming in that that set those people apart are not necessarily available to everybody, you know?
Ashanti:True. True.
Rob Sonic:But it was, it was a good, it was a good I mean, that's why people don't, you know, it doesn't miss it stays, you know, relevant to the people that delve as deeply as they can, you know, and, but it's still almost niche. You know what I'm saying?
Ashanti:Because Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Who who is you know? I mean, there's a lot of good current jazz and shit like that, but it there was that that time was just There's a
Ashanti:lot of things that were happening at that time that were in the air that were a part of it. It felt like there's great there's I've I'm into jazz too, and I Right. I actually work with jazz musicians and blah blah blah. So there's great jazz musicians right now, but that was a very, very different time. I don't know how to explain that.
Ashanti:Like, it's just the vibe of it at that time was very different. There was something about being a jazz player. You know what I mean?
Rob Sonic:Yeah. And and that's that's that's what I'm saying. Like, there are people that that are extremely but there was just something to that time. You know? Yeah.
Rob Sonic:And, and I think a lot of that happened a lot of that happens with with the hip hop, the different eras in in in hip hop music too. You know?
Ashanti:I agree. Your first album came out in 04, Telekintesson.
Rob Sonic:Yes.
Ashanti:What how do you feel like do you feel like there's been this major evolution since that first album or do you feel like you've kinda stayed on the same the same, playing field?
Rob Sonic:No. There's definitely an evolution because the the first one, I'll be honest, like, I I had never produced anything before, I think, Rocket. Gotcha. Rocket is Rocket is a song by Sonic some that came out pretty late in the Sonic some stuff. You know?
Rob Sonic:I think it's on films or, yeah, maybe it's on yeah. Or it was just a single. I think it's on films, but I had never made a beat before that. And that was actually how I sort of made the connection with Def Jokes is is I knew Meach. Meach was handling our our business and stuff for Sonic Song.
Rob Sonic:And, I would see Al at Ozone. Entertainment. So, that was how I sort of made, I played Rocket for Al and I was like, yo, you make a record like this, I'll fucking put it out.
Ashanti:Oh, all right.
Rob Sonic:And I was like, oh shit. I had no idea. I was even making it good here. You know? It was like I remember it was like I was just just all I had was like little bookshelf speakers and an and an MPC 2000 XL and just got it because I had literally was like, it wasn't that I wanted to break away from TME.
Rob Sonic:It was just like, I couldn't, there was always it it's issues when people are look because they were producing for so many people. They were
Ashanti:producing
Rob Sonic:for like half the
Ashanti:Bronx. Right. Right.
Rob Sonic:So, you know what I'm saying? And and running Fred was running his studio, which was right across the street from my building. So it was just hard to get, you know, things going and, and sometimes, and I would be like, well, I'll just, just get this for fun and see what happens. And then I sort of, I sort of developed this sort of sound that I wanted realized that I wanted to rhyme over. And that was more akin to the stuff that it influenced me, the electro stuff.
Rob Sonic:Gotcha. But that first record I think is is is cool because it's a it's a time capsule in a moment in time and it's cool. But I mean, I was like, Sam, you know, I was using, like, test tones as instruments. So, you know,
Ashanti:I was like, oh, that's cool. No. But it's the bro, that's that's hip hop. You know what I mean? At the end of the day, that's hip hop.
Ashanti:Taking what you got. You know what I mean?
Rob Sonic:Doesn't matter nothing. It was, you know, and that's that's sort of what it it was for me at the beginning. And that is that record, you know, if you listen to it, you it's it's cool. I mean, there's definitely some good starter stuff in there, but you know, it's to me at least.
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:But, yeah, it's at this point, you know, I actually have an idea and, and
Ashanti:Right.
Rob Sonic:Know know know my way around things a little bit.
Ashanti:A little bit more. Right. Doing a Hail Mary Mall and collaborating with ASAP. How did that all come about?
Rob Sonic:That would that was just a byproduct of us being on tour all the time. Yeah. Because yeah. Like, he like, he, I think the first show I did with him was actually in Portland Okay. Which is crazy.
Rob Sonic:But, yeah. Like, I I had to fill in. Like, I I had somebody couldn't make it up, maybe Lyft or or Okay. Move or somebody could make it up. I don't remember exactly, but he hit me up and we went and we had it like a blast.
Rob Sonic:You know? Mhmm. We had like a legit good time because I we we weren't we didn't all those dudes and jokes were like in Brooklyn and I was in the Bronx. So I didn't see them as much as as people might think. You know, I wasn't around the the core unit of jokes, all that much.
Rob Sonic:But, yeah, me and Ace, we just, you know, we would see each other at certain things, mostly label, label related and we would, we just kinda clicked, you know? Yeah. And so one time when he needed, somebody to fill in to do the hype stuff Yeah. He was like, yo, you wanna do it? And I went out there and we had a ball and then we just stayed torn together forever.
Ashanti:Where was that in your so your first what was your first tour?
Rob Sonic:My first tour was probably my first like official tour would be Sonic Song.
Ashanti:Sonic Song. Okay.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. And that was
Ashanti:How many days was that like a big was that a big one? Was that a short one?
Rob Sonic:It was me, Mike Ladd. It was Sonic Some, Mike Ladd, and Antipop.
Ashanti:Okay. Oh, okay.
Rob Sonic:We went out to the West Coast. I had never been out never been to the West Coast. I'd never been really out of two places. I had never been out of the DMV
Ashanti:Mhmm.
Rob Sonic:And I'd never been out of the Bronx, really. Mhmm. New York. Let's say New York. I I did live in Queens for about a year and I lived in Brooklyn for about 6 months before I've been but I was in the Bronx for, like, 20 years, 20 years.
Ashanti:Okay.
Rob Sonic:But, so I had never been to the west coast and any of that. And and I guess we Mitchie put this thing together and we went out to the West Coast, and it did not go well. It was it was it there was not a lot of people at those shows.
Ashanti:And How many shows did you guys play?
Rob Sonic:I think we only ended up being able to keep because, you know, like, if there's nobody if
Ashanti:There's nobody there. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Do it. You know what I'm saying? Like, if there's no if nothing is funding the machine, the machine can't go.
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:And that's what we were sort of banking on. We were banking on the the strength that people were were gonna come to these joints. And so a couple of first you know, a couple of nights where it doesn't happen and you're like, oh, shit. Yeah. So I think we had, we ended up doing just 4 on that one.
Rob Sonic:It was Okay. Oh, we did an LA show at the LA Ray, and that's that's kind of a big spot. You know?
Ashanti:Yeah. It's yeah. It's not a small spot.
Rob Sonic:And I I had laryngitis randomly because I used to get sick before every tour. I you know, that's that's one of the things is I used to get sick. And no matter what I did, I'd be like, put myself in a bubble before a tour and I would still get sick. Like one time I got the mumps.
Ashanti:Maybe you think mumps, bro?
Rob Sonic:Who gets the mumps? Nobody gets the mumps. I got well, technically, I had paratitis.
Ashanti:Okay.
Rob Sonic:But that's that's the the shit that does the mumps.
Ashanti:You know? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Like, I woke up. I was married at the time, and I woke up. And my wife was like, yo, why is your fate that you get in a fight? And I was like, not I was drinking heavy.
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. So that's probably also why I was, like
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Always sick. But Yeah. I was drinking like crazy at the time, like like ridiculous amounts of alcohol Yeah. Every night. So I I woke up.
Rob Sonic:I was, like, at a party in the night before, and she she was like, yo, what's wrong with your face, man? You you must have gotten a fight, but some somebody beat your ass. And I got up and I was like, I don't remember fighting anybody. And I got up and my face was all swollen. And I was like, what is happening?
Rob Sonic:I went to open my mouth just to, you know, like wide, like, be like, ah, ah, like, stretch it out and put an open my mouth.
Ashanti:Oh, damn.
Rob Sonic:And it was like all this crazy pain in under my ear and everything else. And I went to the Montefiore and they were like they took one look at my face and were like, yo. You got the the mums, man. You can't come in the in the thing. You can't like, just come straight back here with me.
Ashanti:Weren't they handing out vaccines for that in, like, the eighties, bro?
Rob Sonic:Like Yes. Yes. No. I I was I had my MMR vaccine. But that was what that's what it was.
Rob Sonic:That was the joke, and that was before me and Ace were going to Brazil for the first time.
Ashanti:Right.
Rob Sonic:Right. And I was like, yo. I I don't know what to tell you, bro. I got the mumps. You know?
Rob Sonic:And he he would joke. He'd be like, oh, what you gonna get next? Rubella?
Ashanti:Yeah. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Old school disease, like, the the the plague.
Ashanti:So that tour, so you guys flew out probably and then drove, to do your dates on that tour and then Yeah.
Rob Sonic:We we flew out, rented rented a couple of vans, couple of 15 passengers, and I saw the West Coast and under you know, I we tried to do the tour, but it just wasn't it was like you know, it was that that was my first experience of of tour.
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:And and how that all that stuff works and how, like, really things impact everything about that. Like, who's playing down the street? It was like, like, everywhere we're going, souls of mischief was, like, playing across the street.
Ashanti:That's not good for y'all at all.
Rob Sonic:Well, I mean, you know, you play in the West Coast and they're, like, the biggest, you know, you know, indie rap.
Ashanti:Yeah. They were
Rob Sonic:hot as they on. Like, I wonder like, it was like it was like Soldier Bishops and, like, Slum Village.
Ashanti:Right. Like, right. And it was
Rob Sonic:like we were we're we're like, god. People will be at our show.
Ashanti:It worked out real well. I'm sure.
Rob Sonic:Right. Nobody was at our show.
Ashanti:So by the time so how many so by the time you did that first tour with Def Jokes, you had done a few tours since then or it was just like a couple
Rob Sonic:Oh, no. That was that was Ozone. That was before all the Def Jokes stuff.
Ashanti:Yeah. Yeah. No. That's what I'm saying. By the time so with this tour, you're we were just talking about you had a bunch of stuff in between before you did the Def Jokes thing or or you okay.
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. Yeah. Well, I think I had to well, we had that that record was was sort of a tour for, you know, a few of us had records out. I think, anti pop had, the the one that came out on 75 arc and Mike had, I think, after future at that point, and we had the sanity annex. Mhmm.
Rob Sonic:So this was the beginning of of all of it. You know? Yeah. And, yeah. So so though there that was probably 5 or 6 years before Jokes.
Ashanti:Got you. Yeah. What's what's been your most, like, plush tour experience?
Rob Sonic:All the all the stuff I did with Ace.
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:All that stuff was yeah. Because he's he brings them in. You know? Yeah. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:People come out to see the the kid Ace, and, they those were always we're always well taken care of. I mean, some of those were, you know, because you played when you're like that size. Yeah. You know, on an indie level, like you gotta play a markets and b markets. Yep.
Rob Sonic:So b markets, you're not those aren't really that plush, but for the most part, you know, those
Ashanti:an a market stuff.
Rob Sonic:All those are all those are good, but I I've been blessed.
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:You know what I'm saying? Like like, I've I've had some rough ones and I but for the most part, I would say that people have been, you know, kind of accommodating.
Ashanti:Yeah. What was the roughest one?
Rob Sonic:Man, there's been so there's been a lot of those.
Ashanti:Other than other than your burst your, burst your, your, the Yeah.
Rob Sonic:But that wasn't that wasn't technically at core. But the the the friend of Thor that I tried to do on my own was pretty rough. Yeah. Because that was really that was really some road road dog shit. You know?
Rob Sonic:Okay. That was really like, I'm going out here and I'm seeing what happens and but there was actually good turnouts at that point because it was so far into my career. You know? Yep. Like early stuff, like Sonic some would would get these crazy gigs.
Rob Sonic:Like, some of those were super rough because just because. Yeah. But we'd get these, like, crazy gigs. Like, we would play, like, all tomorrow's party in, like, in in Europe, and it would be that's that's a huge gig for
Ashanti:people. Of course.
Rob Sonic:You know what I'm saying? And and it it was we weren't really, you know, like Mhmm. In our minds, we we belong.
Ashanti:Every everybody is in their minds.
Rob Sonic:We belonged, but, you know, this like, when we get up there and and, you know, the the the the mixers are all fucked up and sending you know, we're sitting there basically talking to the crowd. Like, literally, I'm trying to do stand up for half an hour while my pizza gets fixed during our set at all tomorrow's party. Like Is
Ashanti:that where you hold, like, your commuted your commuted timing, you think, is having to do, you probably always had it.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. I always try to I was always a class clown.
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. I mean, I don't know, like that stuff is hard. Like I would never be a comedian.
Ashanti:No, man, so that's one of my guilty pleasures, man. I go to the comedy club at once a week, once every 2 weeks. No joke. I love comedy. I
Rob Sonic:do. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. True.
Rob Sonic:And I
Ashanti:go see all these great comedians. I keep up with it. I'm really deep into the comedian world. And I just sit there like I would be so terrified. I couldn't give anybody 30 seconds, Let alone like 10, 15, 20, 30 minutes, you know?
Rob Sonic:Right. And those are like those are like intimate settings.
Ashanti:It's wild. You got nothing behind you. You got no one.
Rob Sonic:What about like people like Kevin Hart?
Ashanti:Oh my god, bro.
Rob Sonic:Stadiums, man. Like, are you kidding me?
Ashanti:It's you and a mic, bro.
Rob Sonic:Dude, the the minutes are so long. Yeah. On stage, minutes are so long. Like like, people are like, oh, yeah. You know, you do a half hour set.
Rob Sonic:It's not a big deal. Right?
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:But that shit is forever. Like, I'm like, if I was literally if I'm firing under all cylinders. Right?
Ashanti:Yes.
Rob Sonic:Like, and and I'm really in game shape, I could do 10 songs in 1st minutes.
Ashanti:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:You know what I'm saying? Right. But they and they but there's still time in between where you guys just, like you gotta make you know, you gotta interact with people, and sometimes that is so hard.
Ashanti:It is. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:It is ridiculous. And you yeah. Forget about it. You offend the shit out of people.
Ashanti:You go from having a having some dope ass shit to getting beers thrown at you and shit.
Rob Sonic:Oh, yeah, man. Like, it's so easy. Like, making people laugh because that's what people are there for. Like Yeah. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:I'm here to make me laugh, bro. Yeah. That's shit. Shit, son. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Like like, imagine if somebody if you were beefing some with somebody and he was like, yo, make me laugh then. Be like, alright. That'd be the illest that'd be the illest it'd be the it was fight everybody.
Ashanti:You what speaking of that, you when you and Ace would tour, I remember, you know, your tours, when I was at the label. And I would look at the, like, the set times and all that, and I'd be like, yo, how many minutes is this dude playing? Yeah. What what was the, like, what was the thought process behind that? And I mean, people were engaged the entire time.
Ashanti:It wasn't like it was too much. I just
Rob Sonic:I don't know how. I don't know how. Yeah. Because I and I think that that's that just speaks to to how many people really are really love Ace. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:You know what I'm saying? Like, how how how many people are just and I I am too. Like, it's just the guy he what he does is is really unique and it's like, you know, it's it's intrigued. But 45 minutes of anybody rapping, I'm like, alright. I've I've got I get I gotta go.
Ashanti:Well, you know how it is for cats like me. Like, not only is it, you know let's say somebody does a 75 minute set. I've heard that 75 minute set
Rob Sonic:Yeah.
Ashanti:Oh, I don't know. Yeah. 35, 40 times? Yeah, man. On that in the, like, last month, I'm like, oh, I'm done with this shit, bro.
Ashanti:I don't soon as the you know, soon as everything goes on, I walk away, go get something to eat, go do whatever, and cats are like, yo, why aren't you, you know, like, why aren't you sticking around? I'm like, I've heard this before. I've heard it a couple of times.
Rob Sonic:And that is that is that is essentially what it is for us too. You know what I'm saying?
Ashanti:Right.
Rob Sonic:Like like because with I think the the longest we got our set up too because Ace was just like, I I just need to to do this. You know? I need to make it longer. And we were because we were always doing 45 to an hour Mhmm. For for most of it.
Rob Sonic:And then towards the when the catalogs became so extensive.
Ashanti:Mhmm.
Rob Sonic:There was no way to not make the shows longer because he had to make sure that he was addressing what Like what was current Yep. And his classics. So Right. You know, it's you do something like that, the show it I think it got up to an hour and 40 hour and 45 minutes at some point.
Ashanti:That's just wild to me, man.
Rob Sonic:If I it may have gotten to 2 hours, but it Yeah. It at though at once it got past a 110 minutes
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Of performing, it was all a blur to me. You know? Because the only real the only real breaks we ever took was for our DJ to do their
Ashanti:thing. Right.
Rob Sonic:And those were, like, you know, those were 5, 7, 7, 8 minutes.
Ashanti:Right. The
Rob Sonic:rest of the time was was just
Ashanti:Just like go go go. And it's it's like with y'all, it was definitely like people get up and hey, there's different cadences. It's just bang, bang, bang, right over the head. Just how the records are. You know what I mean?
Rob Sonic:Yeah. It's I don't know how people did it.
Ashanti:Yeah. Including yourself. Including yourself.
Rob Sonic:I think about it sometimes and I'm like, man, listen. I probably got my let's run my knees all messed up. Probably good with that shit.
Ashanti:What's your what's your, what's your probably most memorable tour experience? What do you mean be like? That's that's one that for the books, for sure.
Rob Sonic:I mean, probably the the Coachella's and, like, Bonnaroo was really memorable. Like, the like, that kinda thing, like, not in a 1000000 years that I think I'd be playing for 40 or 50,000 people.
Ashanti:Yeah. Yes.
Rob Sonic:Ever. Like Yeah. I mean, I and I don't. Like, it's not you know, don't get it twisted. I'm not like, oh, you know, I I did that.
Rob Sonic:Like, no. I didn't do that. You know what I'm saying? I was helping somebody do that. You know what I'm saying?
Rob Sonic:And, that was that was crazy though, just to be a part of that. And and I mean, that stuff is it's nutty to to be in those situations is something that I guess everybody dreams about. And, you know, no matter what I was doing, what my role in that was, it was just amazing. I'll never forget that stuff. Like going out to Coachella and having like a a trailer and all that, you know, it's like like you really did something, you know.
Rob Sonic:True. I
Ashanti:was I was be behind the scenes of it, on the other side, but working with Jordan and all of them and Christian and you guys' tours. And, I do remember you you have to remind me. I feel like Ace did 2 or 3 weeks on and 1 week off. Is that what he did when he would do his tours?
Rob Sonic:Yeah. It was like, yeah. I don't think it ever went past 3 weeks. Yeah. I mean, like, in the early in the early days, like, in the early parts of it, we were going a little nutty.
Rob Sonic:Like, we would we would kinda take whatever, and I remember that kinda had to stop after a few
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Because it was just too much. It was like It was. Like, when when you're driving, you know, all day and getting off getting on stage, doing your show Yep. And then you have to get up at, like, 5 in the morning to drive because we didn't we weren't busing it.
Ashanti:Right.
Rob Sonic:We we weren't in the bus. We were in we would always take vans.
Ashanti:Smarter. It's hard it's harder, but it financially, it's smarter. Do you know what I mean?
Rob Sonic:Right. And it I don't I mean, I don't know the logistics of it, but but that's how we did it. And Yeah. That was something we always did from the beginning, you know, from the early days of touring, we were always in the 15 passengers and that eventually just turned into a sprinter and Yeah. But, those, those things were, you know, I feel like I lost what I traded above.
Ashanti:Memorable. Most memorable.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So the, those were the, the, the, the bigger shows, you know, they're like, I think I saw like Santa Gold at, at one of those and like seeing like the police and and and Prince was Yep. The headliner of of Coachella that we played.
Rob Sonic:And that was crazy, man. Like, I am in the vicinity of Prince. You know? I mean, that's probably not a you you guys are in Minneapolis.
Ashanti:It's all it's all it's all,
Rob Sonic:Y'all probably saw a dude walking down the street. Right?
Ashanti:I I run into I ran into Prince a couple times before I moved to the West Coast.
Rob Sonic:Oh, okay. Okay.
Ashanti:Surprisingly. One night was the night I got married, actually. It was kinda crazy. But, yeah, I've definitely run into Prince. I think I I think everyone has their, like, oh man, if I see this person that's hella dope.
Ashanti:But for the most part, we're all in it. So it doesn't really affect us either way, shape or form.
Rob Sonic:With Prince? Oh, I
Ashanti:don't know. No. With Prince? No, no, no, no, no, no.
Rob Sonic:Prince is
Ashanti:def I'm not saying hold on, hold on. Let me be real particular. Prince specifically, I was like, what the fuck? Right? Yes.
Ashanti:With Prince
Rob Sonic:Yeah.
Ashanti:DJ Premier for me. There's a couple other cats, MCA, like shit like that. Yeah. But like other cats and especially being on the management side, on the working side of it, you're like
Rob Sonic:Sure. Sure.
Ashanti:You're either paying somebody or you're getting them paid. Like your interaction with them is pretty chill. You know what I mean? Like Yeah. It's not some homey shit.
Ashanti:So yeah.
Rob Sonic:I can dig that. I can dig that.
Ashanti:Yeah. But, yeah, I mean, there's definitely been moments where I was like, it's kinda wild that I'm involved in this right now and this is happening. Do you know what I'm saying? Yes. Like Yes.
Ashanti:When you sit there and you think about it, really. You know what I mean?
Rob Sonic:Yeah. Right. And that's that's that's kind of why probably those are the most memorable. I mean, we had, like, the, you know, there was always, like, the 9 thirties and there there were clubs all over the the country that would always be super memorable just because of just the vibe and and the shows always went up and there was always good sound system. You didn't have to, like, stress too many things.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. You know? Yeah. And then there's some that were memorable for the other reasons. Right.
Rob Sonic:Right. You know what I'm saying? Like, so so I guess that I remember all of them. And, like, if if they're not all right in the front. You know?
Rob Sonic:Right. But they're all able to be recalled. You know? Right. Like, every everything.
Rob Sonic:You know? It's it's it was a good time.
Ashanti:Yeah. If you had to, wait. I can't remember. You guys went out with a TM. Right?
Rob Sonic:A few different ones. Yeah.
Ashanti:Yeah. Who was your main scam?
Rob Sonic:Probably James.
Ashanti:Oh, yeah. James. Yeah. Yep. Yep.
Ashanti:Yeah. Baker, bro. Baker's the boy, bro.
Rob Sonic:Is it with Baker? Is that his
Ashanti:James Baker. Yeah. You talking about the British dude? No. No.
Ashanti:No. No. Oh, which James? Oh, j Oh. I know exact James Lynch, bro.
Ashanti:James Lynch. Lynch is
Rob Sonic:probably one we toured with the most. Yeah.
Ashanti:Lynch is like, Lynch is one of the craziest motherfuckers on the planet, bro. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:I'm about
Ashanti:to you know what? That's a good I'm a get his ass on here, bro. Actually, I need to catch up with him, bro. Lynch is wild, bro.
Rob Sonic:Yeah, man.
Ashanti:I wonder how he is these days, bro.
Rob Sonic:Who knows? But, yeah, he he was probably the most and then there was we went out with Paul a couple times.
Ashanti:Oh, yeah. Paul's the boy. Paul's the boy too.
Rob Sonic:Paul Wickman.
Ashanti:Paul Wickman. Yeah, he's a boy too. Paul is, he's very unassuming, you know what I mean? But he knows his shit bro. So a few more questions and I'll get you out of here.
Ashanti:Number 1 is, what would you be doing if you weren't rapping? Like what would you be doing in your life?
Rob Sonic:Oh, man, you know? In my older age, I'm like, what am I gonna be doing? Because I mean, I I really don't know. I mean,
Ashanti:I Would you still have been connected to music, you think, in
Rob Sonic:some some sort of Yeah. I there was no stopping that. When when I started and my, devotion to it and and what I wanted to do, my drive was was that was it for me. That was the only thing that connected to me so deeply that I would do anything with that goal in mind, you know, anything I was having to do was just a means to get to that. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:You know? So and that's what I did. And and, you know, it's I I don't really know. It's when I think about that, I'm like, there were a couple of moments where there were some opportunities, like I could have been like regional manager of of a department store on the East Coast called Ames. Okay.
Rob Sonic:Which I think ended up becoming Target or Walmart or some, like something else, you know, it was like the, one of the early big box stores on the east coast. Yeah. And they liked me so much that they were, you know, I think I was fresh out of high school. I was like 18 years old and they were like, we want you to be, you know, store manager. And then eventually we wanna set you up to be regional manager.
Ashanti:I could see myself working for you as a regional manager, bro. Yeah. I feel like we would probably spend most of our time smoking pot out back. Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. I could I don't know I don't know if I coulda done it. Like, like, it was because they were like I like I was a hard worker at everything I did. You know? I had so many jobs before I started doing music full time.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. And, like, I just that was just me. It's I just needed I worked and I worked hard. I did I had everything I did. And they were just like, well, you you're good at working.
Rob Sonic:You know? So because that's really all all you do to become like a in retail and and Yeah.
Ashanti:You just gotta work hard.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. You just have to be a hard worker. Yeah. There there's nothing that really separates any regional manager from another one, I guess. Right.
Rob Sonic:Except for the for the fact that they work hard. Yeah. And that's that's just what I've always done. I've just been a hard worker. So that's the only reason I've made anything in music was because I'm not like I said, my left hand don't really work that well when it comes to music, and I'm kind of you know, I don't think I'm that sharp, but, you know, but I work hard, you know?
Rob Sonic:And, and so that that was really the only opportunity I had to do anything else. The rest was, yeah, it wasn't it wasn't looking too bright for me. I hated school. I didn't like school at all. I didn't like school.
Rob Sonic:I didn't like, there wasn't a lot there's not not money come you know, there's no money in the family. So Yeah. There were there's not a lot of opportunity.
Ashanti:Right. Right.
Rob Sonic:Well, not for me. You know? My sister got lucky. My sister got lucky when it come up.
Ashanti:Did she marry up or what?
Rob Sonic:No. She she got in on some tech shit like before Oh, dope. Before tech shit was tech shit.
Ashanti:Yeah. Good for her,
Rob Sonic:man. Yeah.
Ashanti:Good for her. Anything upcoming upcoming projects?
Rob Sonic:I am working on an album that that I keep saying that I I shoulda had it out before. Like, I I should have had it out probably a year ago, but I'm I'm having to, you know, it's it's different for me now, you know, because I'm not like torn. I'm not I'm not, you know, I have to literally make ends meet again, you know, like like Yeah. I have to tie everything up and Yeah. So it it kinda gets in the way a little bit of Yeah.
Rob Sonic:What I really wanna be doing, which is that, but I am working on.
Ashanti:It.
Rob Sonic:Good. And, hopefully, it'll be out by this year, but I've said that now for 2 years. I'll
Ashanti:show you. I I and also, there's a lot of reasons these things take time too. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah.
Ashanti:I mean,
Rob Sonic:it's it's it's, you know, it's plus, I mean, it's not necessarily the easiest thing to make a record.
Ashanti:Oh, man. It's hard as shit, bro. I don't and that's like step 1. Like, making it's, like, the first step. You know what I mean?
Rob Sonic:Yeah. And then for it to be good, it's like, you know, because the the older you get and the more understanding you have of music, you can't and hear things differently. When you're first starting out, there's like, sort of a hubris to it, you know, like, like what I'm doing is good. Yeah. And there's this confidence, you know, the it's of youth and and just to know that you're the illest plus music has changed so much.
Ashanti:Yeah. It has.
Rob Sonic:You know what I'm saying? Because I mean, how many what what are people are people listening to people bar now? Yeah. You know, people are, but
Ashanti:Not like you know,
Rob Sonic:To you know, there's so many things you that's like a whole podcast in itself.
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. How the the the music itself has changed and and what is actually, like, you know, I guess, I don't know, lucrative to people, you know? And and
Ashanti:we just had a whole reckoning. Right. We just had a whole reckoning and and rap with that Kendrick. You know, it it all it answered a question of like, it made you feel good that there still is the love for the arc, you know what I mean, at the end of the day.
Rob Sonic:But but if you think about it, like, if it wasn't those 2 Yeah. They wouldn't have yeah. It wouldn't have been anything like this. So, you know, and that speaks to, you know, that speaks to their power and that but it also speaks to just the climate of it. It's like
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:You know, I don't I don't know. It's just it's that too. Because, you know, the older you get in this shit, like, the more you think about those things and you think about, well, yeah, I gotta you know, the car note is due, the rent is due, and and, I gotta, you know And the bus shit
Ashanti:it done.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. And with with streaming is, you know, there's the forget it. No. I'm just complaining. Let me
Ashanti:ask you this. If you had to, leave leave the people with one thing, someone who's trying to get into this or wants to do this, what's the one thing you would say? I know it's a cliche question, but I'm always curious about it.
Rob Sonic:Just you'll know that if you're starting out, you will know after, probably 3 or 4 years. You'll know if you're gonna stay in it or not. You know? So just, you know, if you really love it and you you will ride whatever it is and and whatever direction you're gonna go in that. And also I think it's it's very important to not, you know, like I was just talking about it about the the confidence that comes with youth and stuff like that.
Rob Sonic:Don't let that don't let that mess up in a, you know, like, listening to people.
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:You know what I'm saying? But it's also it's also that's a dangerous it's just such a hard thing to do.
Ashanti:Yeah. It's it's you gotta be careful. You gotta be right
Rob Sonic:in the
Ashanti:middle of it. Yeah. You know what I mean?
Rob Sonic:You got and you gotta, like, get with the right people. Like, getting with the right people is such a big thing. Yeah. Because there's so many people in this business that are literally not the right people.
Ashanti:Yeah. I think there's more not right people than there are right people.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. I mean, there's there's people in this business that are not have no they they they do not care.
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Literally do not care about music or you as a person, but
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:But that's that is, you
Ashanti:know That's a part of it.
Rob Sonic:That's with every business, I'm sure. You know?
Ashanti:Yeah. And then give me, before we jump off, give me your, what's what's your one tip on tour?
Rob Sonic:Probably take as many pictures, man.
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Like, I didn't take enough pictures of that shoot.
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:You know? I, it's it because it it touring when you get to if you're lucky enough to be a part of a tour like I was, that was large and and, you know, good in in a lot of ways, you tend to be in the moment more than you are. Mhmm. And you somehow aren't in the moment. Right.
Rob Sonic:You're saying because you're only in these cities every once in a while for, you know, 12 hours sometimes.
Ashanti:Right.
Rob Sonic:And, but just, you know, try and see things.
Ashanti:Right.
Rob Sonic:You know? Because I didn't I did I went to a few things that I like, I was in Japan and Australia and and places like that, and I don't have any pictures of that shit. Right. And I was, I was there. Like, sometimes I have to like, yeah, I was in Japan.
Ashanti:Right.
Rob Sonic:I was there when people are talking about Tokyo or something.
Ashanti:Yeah.
Rob Sonic:Like, yeah, I've been there. Yeah. You know? And that's that's that's a wild it's a it's a it's a, like, a head game or whatever. I
Ashanti:don't know.
Rob Sonic:It's a head trip
Ashanti:because Head trip.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. Like, I don't know if like like that that really happens. You know? So
Ashanti:it's wild. I'm going through that myself sometimes. With that with that said, I'm a get you up out of here, man. Let you let you have the rest of your day. We should talk soon, though.
Ashanti:Actually, I'll just hit you up, and we'll talk soon. Just because I'm I just wanna catch up in general and just, like, see see what's going
Rob Sonic:on. Of course. But I
Ashanti:really appreciate you being on the show, bro.
Rob Sonic:Yeah. Thank you. Thank you for having me, man. It's been good.
Ashanti:You're in that first slate of people. You're in good, like, good group of people. So
Rob Sonic:That's what's up, man. I hope I hope I didn't ramble too much.
Ashanti:No, man. That's we're here to we're here to talk. That's what we're here to do.
Rob Sonic:Hell yeah.
Ashanti:Work. Alright. We'll talk to you soon, my guy.
Rob Sonic:Alright, brother.
Ashanti:Alright, man. Yep. Bye. Thanks for tuning in to the loadout. This episode was produced by me with music by the incredible Mike and additional editing and mixing also by Mike.
Ashanti:If you enjoyed this conversation, don't forget to subscribe and rate the podcast. Follow me at probably Ashanti on all platforms. Until next time, keep buying those tickets. Peace.